So Called Brain Buckle...

[Lenny]

So, the Brain Buckle, commonly attributed to penal battalions. This isn't documented and no evidence of it being used this way has ever been found.

Like many collectors I believe it was a post war buckle, fraudulently stamped B&N 43. Recently I was shown a period post war pic of a fireman wearing this buckle, so that's good enough for me.

[Davejb]

I,ve seen these buckles before and there was some debate over them, but you have proof positive of post war  use, but how much after the war, could these have actually been around at the end of the war One of the guys on WRF collected nothing but buckles and he had an extensive collection , among which were a few of these and a debate arose over them, mainly involving authenticity, but are they post war period , or were these actually made during and after  the war and used by firemen , or are the markings truly false, checking online I found a site called Bryns Belt Buckles, one of these is shown as being a penal buckle with exactly the same date and maker and the same rear set up as yours

[DAK D]

Since there was a penal battalion in North Africa (999) it would be very interesting to me to actually find a wartime photo of these being worn, but I doubt we will ever see one. The evidence that that they were worn post war is very clear in the photo Lenny has posted and it does suggest these were made during or after hostilities and maybe they were made in late 1945?

D

 

[lach470]

They are all dated 43 by Breg&Nolte. I believe they were used during the war by civilians (like the firefighter) and most probably immediately after the conflict as well. Nonetheless an interesting German buckle that deserves a place in belt buckle collections. 

Rob

ps....I can share my example when I get in. It's the same as yours Lenny! 

[Lenny]

11 hours ago, lach470 said:

They are all dated 43 by Breg&Nolte. I believe they were used during the war by civilians (like the firefighter) and most probably immediately after the conflict as well. Nonetheless an interesting German buckle that deserves a place in belt buckle collections. 

Rob

ps....I can share my example when I get in. It's the same as yours Lenny! 

Share away, that's what we're here for... Agreed, it's one that every buckle collector should have. I'm not convinced the B&N maker mark is wartime, some reckon it was post war applied to date these war time.

[dagodave]

Personally  I've always stayed away from these buckles. I have no evidence  for or against them so I cannot say.

[regiment739]

The buckles are real enough and probably made in 43, the question is were they made for a specific purpose?  The penal battalion has never been proven and as mentioned no photographic evidence has come to light.  Were they made like this during the war period for civil defence?  Were these used post war from surplus B&N stock and re-stamped with the so called brain design or were the stamped out from a batch of blanks ready to be used?  Lots of questions, theories but again no written evidence as yet

[Richard Auld]

Is it possible that the stamp is correct and that the machines were used again post war to make such items? I have a 1943 dated mess tin that is clearly post war produced for the THW and blue painted. 

[Richard Auld]

Guys, While looking for something completely different I found this, by way of explanation a picture paints a 1000 words!

Rich

[Quantrill]

I am a long time buckle collector.  Nobody really knows for sure but here are my thoughts.  1.  The buckle itself is very ugly and is not tied to any organization.  The Germans generally produced buckles that tied the wearer to an organization. 2.  All of the buckles are marked B &N 43.  Interesting that no other year designation has appeared.  3. No documented period photos of wear or period documentation concerning the buckle has appeared.  i started collecting buckles in the early  1970s in Germany when I was in the service.  Buckles were common and cheap.  I never so this buckle.   My recollection is that really started hitting the market in the late 1980's   4. Lastly, why would the Germans bother to create a special penal buckle? These would be prisoners.  More likely to give them a rope to hold up their pants. If they were supposedly for staff, the number needed would have been very small and I  have seen a lot of these buckles at shows and on Ebay.   Production of buckles cost money especially during the war and I really doubt the Germans would have spent money on an obscure non military item.   For what its worth.

[Davejb]

Thats a very good point you make about the penal prisoners, no one in there right mind would let a convicted prisoner have a metal buckle that would do harm to others let alone each other and the staff, I seem to recall seeing some of these at one of the early War and Peace shows and not  a lot of people were interested and I think they were there to years ago as well

[Tuniccollector]

Hello

Here a pic I found in a internet

archive, the photo of a Member

of the Strafbatallion 999

(Penal batallion 999)

of the Wehrmacht.

The Buckle I enlarged on 2nd

photo.

 

[lach470]

Looks to me like it is a regular Heer buckle. 

Cheers!

Rob